Bisq 2 social trading concept

[chimp1984]

I have not thought myself too much about the social trading/reputation based trade protocol (we should find a sticky name for it- I stick with social trading for now until something better come up). But to get the ball rolling it might be good to share my rough ideas. Please note that all is very preliminary and totally open to change. Just a very first sketch...

• Target are newbies who have no Bitcoin, users who want to get their frist experience with Bisq by a more human guided/social way or traders who like the social aspect and want to engage in interaction with other traders
• There are chat channels for several major markets (BTC/USD, BTC/EUR) and one for other niche markets
• Traders can post their offers in a structured text form to the channel but users can switch the channel display to see only those offers, excluding other chat text. If that would not work out that well from UX we could have a separate offer book table with the offers.
• Structured offer text is created from s simplified create offer screen and the text derived from that. So that makes it easier for processing/filtering but still stays in the chat message flow. Those offers will though get a graphical indication to be easier to find.
• Users still can post any text as intention for trading, so the structure format is not enforced
• Traders can contact others to engage in a private chat
• Traders can take an offer (there will be a take-offer button/icon when the chat text is an offer) and by that open a private chat with the maker. The offer stays online and gets only removed manually by the maker (perpetuum offers)
• It is only for BTC to fiat
• BTC sellers need to have reputation earned by burned BSQ
• BTC sellers create a custom user name which might clash with existing ones but it get extended by a short phrase derived from the pubkey hash and an icon (e.g. cool robot icon) which in combination should create a unique impersonation-proof identifier
• The newbie buyer can create also their user name but can skip that to get a randomly generated one. For them reputation is not important.
• The buyer need to send fiat first. After receipt the seller release. This can have a delay of max 2 days (TBD) in case there are chargeback risks with the chosen payment method.
• The seller can post offers as well as the buyer
• The price premium carries indirectly the trade fee. The seller pays the trade fee by burning BSQ.
• There is a min. amount for burned BSQ of 50 BSQ (TBD) and it will give the seller 1 months (TBD) access to be in that market. After that time the seller need to burn again min. 50 BSQ. Some variations of that model are possible...
• After the trade the buyer is requested to provide feedback which will be publicly visible to others. That way others can see the number of past trades of a seller and the feedback score.
• The buyer can optionally write text as feedback. But to select a 1-10 star rating should be mandatory if UX allows that.
• Also the seller can/should leave feedback but its less relevant for the system
• The chat should be accessible after the trade at least for a certain time period. To auto delete chat content after some time (e.g. 2 weeks) would be good also to decrease potential privacy risks.
• After the trade the buyer will get displayed some tutorial-like educational screen to learn more about Bisq so that they get prepared for the standard trade protocols.
• Price premiums can be expected in the 10-15% range. So that can be used as motivation that users move on and only use that protocol type for introductionary trading.
• Mediation support is available in case of problems but they cannot really help to resolve hard conflicts but only try to help. Their judgement thought can be included in the traders profile, so a trader getting too many problems will lose reputation.

How to become a seller for the "social trading" channels?

• Sellers are expected to be experienced with Bisq and the DAO.
• They either have already some BSQ or buy BSQ on Bisq 1 (as long DAO and BSQ swaps are not integrated in Bisq 2)
• They go to the "Proof of Burn" section in the DAO menu and set the amount (min 50 BSQ) and add as pre-image their pubkey hash from their Bisq 2 social trading identity.
• After 1 confirmation that tx is usable as proof for the burned BSQ. As long the DAO is not integrated in Bisq 2 we use a bridge solution to move that DAO tx data over to the P2P network in Bisq 2. TBD how exactly to do that.
• In Bisq 2 the proof is visible after the bridge has published that data and the buyer as well as any trader can see the burned BSQ attached to the user profile
• The accumulated burned BSQ over longer period of time is visible as well. The reputation grows with each additional burning. Time period is an important aspect for reputation. E.g. a trader who was active 6 months with 50 BSQ each month is more trustworthy than one who is new with 300 BSQ burned as being longer active are equivalent to "repeated games" and shows more commitment.

We could extend the proof for reputation to other means like social media accounts, BSQ bond,... and other markets (altcoins, stablecoins) but I think it might be better to have first one more constrained version and see how well that works and if there is demand for more options. Also the burning BSQ solves the fee problem which is not the case with other options.
Adding more options would make it more complicate as well and that would counter the primary goal of that protocol.

Any feedback welcome!

[alkum]

The buyer can optionally write text as feedback. [...]
Also the seller can/should leave feedback but its less relevant for the system

With some fiat payments, the full names of both sender and receiver are known to both of them.

Allowing free text feedback can lead to privacy leaks for the counterparty ("Miguel was very responsive and sent the fiat on time, would recommend").

To mitigate that, maybe we should start with only a five-star rating system.

[chimp1984]

I think having a chat already opens that risk. I see the social aspects will not work perfectly well with highest privacy protections. So I guess those who are more concerned will just ignore those features. Limiting too much the social features might reduce too much the potential effect. But sure there are lot of details to figure out and I did not mean that I oppose to that what you posted, just to keep in mind that target group for those features is likely not the highly privacy minded traders.

[ripcurlx]

I also see this more as a first-time BTC buy use case to be able to transact privately afterwards on Bisq. But yes, for the BSQ seller it carries some risk (# of ratings == # of trades and if we add the amount somehow more data will be leaked). We definitely should guide the user after the first trade to continue trading on Bisq. The good thing to integrate this into the Bisq app is, that we'll finally solve the "I don't have any BTC to trade on Bisq" problem within the app.

[Conza88]

Solved by simply adding instructions not to include name in review.

[pazza83]

I agree that it is right to make Bisq more accessible to newbies with no Bitcoin. Having this platform integrated in Bisq instead of Keybase / Matrix would be a positive move.

I also think the social trading model proposed will provide a high percentage of users with a positive user experience of using Bisq without worrying about having a security deposit available.

I think one aspect that should not be overlooked is that BTC Sellers might be choosing to sell BTC to new users in order to help onboard new users to Bisq / Bitcoin.

For BTC buyers looking to make payment with a less common payment method eg Amazon eGift Cards, or for a less common currency eg INR, I would not want a potential BTC seller to be put off from assisting the user by having to burn an amount of BSQ that might well exceed the profit they would make from a one-off trade.

Would it be possible to link the burning of BSQ to the volume traded.

Eg:

• When BTC Buyer submits feedback this counts as an amount required to be burned by the BTC Seller.
• If the BTC seller has burned more than the total BSQ required to be burnt then their feedback will be shown. If not it will be hidden.

I share the concerns raised by @alkum

Trading with new users brings with it increased risk that the users are unaware of trading rules. For example, I feel like small value transactions are more likely to get a reference to Bitcoin/Bisq etc in the reason for payment field.

[chimp1984]

For BTC buyers looking to make payment with a less common payment method eg Amazon eGift Cards, or for a less common currency eg INR, I would not want a potential BTC seller to be put off from assisting the user by having to burn an amount of BSQ that might well exceed the profit they would make from a one-off trade.

Would it be possible to link the burning of BSQ to the volume traded.

Yes those are good points.
I have not thought too much about how to link to trade volume but I considered that as well. It will depend a bit on the actual protocol implementation if its easy to track the trade volume.

Trading with new users brings with it increased risk that the users are unaware of trading rules. For example, I feel like small value transactions are more likely to get a reference to Bitcoin/Bisq etc in the reason for payment field.

Yes we have to find the right mix here. But I still think if we are overly cautious it might end up being too similar to the normal trade protocols and lose the "easy touch" - but sure something to consider.

[Conza88]

"Yes we have to find the right mix here. But I still think if we are overly cautious it might end up being too similar to the normal trade protocols and lose the "easy touch" - but sure something to consider."

Indeed. Gotta be easy peasy. New noobs to onboard.

[UX-P]

Hi,

I've updated the User Flow diagram based on what has been discussed.

Burning BSQ UX Journey for Reputable Trader

• RT creates username on Bisq 2, this process generates a public hash key/ Pre-image and includes a ´copy’ icon as a shortcut to copy text.

• RT copies the public hash key and clicks a button directing them to Bisq v1 ´Proof of Burn’ landing page.

• RT enters ´Pre-image’ (include an ‘i’ tooltip by the ‘pre image’ sub-header), enters ‘BSQ 'amount' to burn and clicks the ‘Burn’ button.

• A message/progress bar appears showing that Bisq is awaiting confirmation, the UI should then include a button redirecting the RT to the Bisq V2 Reputable Trader profile page.

• A ‘burnt’ badge or a type of icon can now be seen next to RT's profile image. Consider a 'burn bar' instead of showing the amount of BSQ, or renaming it as a 'burn score' so that it is less associated with funds.

• RT can now proceed to create an offer to publish in the offer book!

Feedback and considerations are welcome of course, and any solutions to minimise the user journey as much as possible is always beneficial.

[chimp1984]

I have created a discussion entry in the Bisq 2 repo about the social trading concept. Its to some extent covered here but a few things got added and further developed.
bisq-network/bisq2#64

Sorry for starting another discussion there but I wanted to have a more spec-like description for myself for development so I started to write it down and as it overlaps with things written here aleady it would have been not such a good fit to post here...

[UX-P]

I have looked into potential users of the reputable trading protocol via social media and analysed the most common topics, then grouped them to create this affinity map. Here is a quick summary below.

Learning Guides

As this is aimed at new traders, the UI should act as a learning experience. A place to seek help, guidance, be social and trade.

Finding: Education is a necessity for the New Trader. It is essential to identify key stages where the user will require guidance, and use it as a teaching opportunity.

Insight: New traders have a lack of knowledge/experience and seek a reliable source. They would like to make smart choices to consequently buy from a secure, trusted, user friendly exchange.

Solution: Include guides and ensure they are easily accessible from appropriate points in the UI

Example of guides to be included:

Getting started
Being safe online
About bisq
Video tutorial
Cancelling a trade
Mnemonic word seed
Roles
FAQ

Tips for New Traders

Trader tips are a useful way to advise, here are examples of a few tips left by users on Reddit and Twitter:

Do your research
Follow crypto news sites
keep wallet private
Do not respond to strangers messaging you
Never store your Bitcoins on an exchange or web wallet
Buy your bitcoins and withdraw it
Educate

Solution: Include tips, advice and suggestions. Link all guides to UI and make accessible via the support page

Channel/ Chat Terms

Finding: Social platforms for trading include rules and terms, something that is encouraged by Reddit, paxful, local bitcoin and local Monero.

Insight : Users require rules and regulations to help wean out scammers and avoid malicious misconduct.

Solution: Include the following on the UI

Trading Terms
Chat rules
Channel rules
Penalties
Scam reporting option

Warnings

Finding: New Traders are hesitant to purchase from a P2P platform as they are wary of untrustworthy traders

Solution: Provide warnings at appropriate points of the user journey
Warn users of irreversible actions
Warn users of scammers
Provide a blocked list
Do’s and don’ts

Feedback

Finding: Users of an alternative platform have complained about the inability to leave feedback on one of the trading social platforms and instead posted publicly on social media.

Insight: Users like to leave feedback. It goes directly to the contributors and is highly influential for other traders, it helps to make that important decision of who to trade with and helps to form an idea of what to expect as a new trader.

Solution: Include channels where users are able to leave suggestions and feedback after trade is complete.

Keywords

Finding: There are common words that are being used frequently when describing bisq.

Insight: New traders must be aware of Bisq’s mission, aims and objectives

Solution: Include slogan and mission statement on the UI. Use keywords:

Secure
No Kyc
Honesty
P2P
Decentralisation

[chimp1984]

Great thanks for the insightful research!

Do you recommend to add most of that content in the desktop application or rather use the webpage and add links in the app to point to that?

Benefits with webpage would be that it is more accessible also to users who have not yet installed Bisq and that it can be independently and easier updated. Drawback is that users leave the app and need to go back later.
We could also add a webview in the app and render HTML content but that increases the security vulnerability as well has some costs on performance (WebKit gets started in java in that case), so I would rather prefer to not go that route.

[chimp1984]

More feedback after reading the affinity map:

• It seems to me the social area is a topic where users do not come with lot of input/vision/expectation. I guess one reason for that might be that there are no platforms out yet which are offering that vision Bisq 2 is trying to create. I think one mental model and maybe even a "brand name" for that area could be "Satoshi square" [1], a concept from very early days when Bitcoiners met spontaniously at an announced public space to exchange Bitcoin in person and discuss about Bitcoin. Bitcoin meetups have been kind of follow-up trend over the years. I think to re-create the spirit of that idea sould be our goal with the "social trading" concept.
• Maybe we should bring in the DAO concept a bit more. Make clear that Bisq is a community project owned and controlled by its contributors and everyone is invited to partizipate.

[1]
https://letstalkbitcoin.com/the-significance-of-satoshi-square
https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2019/03/23/satoshi-square-how-bitcoin-took-over-a-park-and-then-the-world/
https://do512.com/venues/satoshi-square-bitcoin-exchange-social-club
https://bitcoinist.com/satoshi-square-a-bitcoin-exchange-and-social-club/

[UX-P]

Thanks for the feedback, the 'Satoshi Square' concept is a strong analysis and definitely something to look more into in relation to this protocol.

Do you recommend to add most of that content in the desktop application or rather use the webpage and add links in the app to point to that?

These belong at different points of the user journey.

Location suggestions (in italic)

Getting started
A quick guide or tutorial available on Bisq 2 welcome page, with the option to skip

Trading terms
An optional box displayed on RT ‘create profile’ page where the user can add their trading terms

Chat rules
A link in 'chat' confirmation box before initiating P2P chat

Penalties
Displayed clearly on the channel profile

Irreversible actions
A pop up box asking the user to confirm their choice before officialising.

Tips for Users
A sub tab in support tab

Feedback and suggestions
A 'suggestions' channel where users can share ideas and suggestions.
Feedback can be received at the end of trade

Keywords
Display mission statement on loading page

Information on cancelling trades, roles, FAQ etc.
Documentation listed as sub tabs under support tab, links in the app pointing to the webpage.

[UX-P]

Here are wireframe designs showing the locations of the above suggestions:

Page 1
Tutorial

Page 2
Trading Terms

Page 3/4
Trading Rules and Penalties

Page 5
Tips and tricks

Page 6
Suggestions

Page 7
Channel rules and Penalties

Page 8
Feedback

[Conza88]

"Satoshi square" nails it imo.
Sats - so small transactions, and square/community vibe.

[UX-P]

Support Agent Summary

A user seeks a Support Agent’s advice expecting detailed responses that take too long to find somewhere else and are difficult to search for.
Current Support Agents/ Mediators in Bisq tend to do this really well. They provide friendly, personalised responses which has the user feeling comfortable enough to keep the conversation going on a public chat, the user leaves the chat more knowledgeable and guided in the right direction with the confidence to continue their search independently.

Social Protocol- The Support Agent’s Role and Responsibilities
Provide Support in channel
Provide Support during trade chats
Provide Advice
Offer guidance
Help to correct trading mistakes
Report misconduct
Issue penalties where necessary
Remove or flag feedback and comments mentioning names
General help

It should be made clear to both trading parties that the Support Agent position is limited to an advisory role and the Support Agent is in no way responsible for the outcome of the trade.

Reputable traders would typically be trusted expert users. This type of profile may have the ability to help traders during the trade chat if the issue is something that is easily rectified without the intervention of a Support Agent.

Common Issues/ Mistakes
Transferring the incorrect amount
Entering the wrong name during payment
Misunderstanding the trading process

Support Agent user journey

This has been created from a usability perspective however, the user journey is open to adjustment.

View a recent update to the user flow- Support Process

Scenario: A new trader requires advice on payment details while engaging in a trading chat with a reputable trader and signals the Support Agent for help.

Summary in text version
Trader: click support button > enter brief issue description > Sends invite to Support Agent

Support Agent: Support Agent bonding Process > Support Agent receives notification > opens and reviews issue > accepts invite > Support Agent enters chat > Support Agent initiates private chat with each party > Support Agent concludes advice on group chat > stay in chat? > no > Support Agent leaves the chat > trade complete > Trader leaves feedback.

Stay in chat > yes > support stays till trade ends > trade complete > trader leaves feedback

Key User Touchpoints

Support button
Help is often located on the bottom right side of the UI. The support button should be placed on the right and contrast from the rest of the page.

Invite
An invite window can be displayed highlighting the Support Agent’s responsibilities along with a disclaimer.

NT enters brief issue description
The Support Agent will be aware of the issue before entering the chat, this could potentially save time on having to scroll through the conversation history and ensures the Support Agent is better prepared in solving the issue as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Support Agent initiates chat
Currently on Bisq 1, the user can not see the other trader's conversation with the Mediator, which encourages a level of confidentiality.
The Support Agent will have the option to speak to traders individually which could potentially be preferable, this is to better manage both parties.

The issue description could be displayed in the 1-on-1 private chat between the Support Agent and the NT, to save time in the NT having to detail the issue again, otherwise they may be required to repeat themselves which could potentially cause frustration.

Perhaps the Support Agent only posts the conclusion on the group chat if necessary.

Stay in Chat optIon
The Support Agent has the option to stay or leave the chat once the issue has been resolved.

The Support agent asks if either party would like him to stay in chat once the issue is settled. This decision could perhaps be left to the NT as they initiated the support.

If the Support Agent is still in the chat, they should be the last to leave in case there are any further questions from either trader.

Leaving feedback
As mentioned in this discussion, there may be privacy considerations regarding feedback. If text based feedback is included in this protocol, rules are required to be displayed on the UI

Example of Feedback rules
Always mention a trader by username only
Do not divulge any confidential information such as payment details, bank details etc.
Do not quote or reference real identity in or out of the chat

Should there be a support Agent feedback rating system? It's good for customer feedback, helps with user research and improvements. Maybe the star rating system @alkum mentioned would be best for this.

UX Considerations

Notifications
A Notification is received by the support agent once a trader sends an invite
A Notification when the Support Agent has joined the chat
A Notification when the Support Agent has left the chat
Display ‘Agent is typing’ when support agent is typing in chat

Notifications alerts the user of the Support Agent's presence and avoid delays, ensuring the trader is seen to as soon as possible rather than enduring a long waiting period.

Time Stamps
Time stamps act as a reference for when the Support Agent, NT, RT require to use the chat log as a reminder of specific points during the resolution process.

Text
The Support Agent text or background should be in a different colour
then that of the other traders in the chat.

Documentation upload
Like Bisq 1, provide the user the option to upload documentation. The trader may be required to send proof of documents, the Support Agent can only confirm on the group chat that it has been viewed but can not determine the outcome of the trade.

Specify Support Agent availability
It is important to make clear to the user the hours of when the support agent is available to help. It may not be possible for the agent to be available at all times, however, the trader will assume the agent is online if not told otherwise.

A Persistent session
If Bisq 2 does shut down unexpectedly users should be able to reopen the app and proceed from where they left off without a noticeable interruption.

Of course I have not considered if this user journey is technically applicable so feedback is welcome.

[UX-P]

This Support Agent Summary would be better titled Mediator Summary to avoid confusion

@jmacxx yes, I can see where there is confusion in the title. I have named the role Support agent as an overall description and not as a reference to the current Bisq role. It could definitely be changed to Mediator, or even a new name to describe this role e.g. Bisq Advisor (just an example). The title ‘Mediator’ keeps that level of familiarity if traders were to continue from Bisq 2 to 1, however it may potentially confuse the user as some duties differentiate from Bisq 1, but this shouldn’t be too much of an issue if the mediator's limitations are clearly defined.

I think there should be clear roles for both Support Agent and Mediator in Bisq 2.

Support Agents are essentially technicians which are not currently bonded.

@pazza83 splitting the role is a good idea, it encourages proficiency and an increasingly speedier service. But from what @jmacxx has pointed out in reference to the Support Agents as technicians, a tech focused and trade focused split could be more beneficial, what do you think?
I noticed that there are many questions based on technical issues in the support channel. It would be useful to have a defined ‘Technical Advisor/Agent’ role on Bisq 2, making it clear to the user that this is someone who specialises in answering and managing all tech related enquiries while the advisory role defined above, remains predominantly trade related.

[w0000000t]

Something interesting is brewing in this thread, I like the idea of a new name (or role, or what you want to call it) where a support agent, per se, acts on external venues like matrix, forum, wiki, reddit, telegram and so on, while an "advisor" is active in the application's chats, to intervene during the action.

[w0000000t]

One consideration @UX-P though, I notice you refer to "Bisq2" and "Bisq1" in your posts, maybe what you mean is respectively "Bisq2 with trusted reputable trading" and "Bisq2 with legacy escrow protocol"?

[UX-P]

@w0000000t with there being various protocols, I can see how it can get confusing. I'm referring to Bisq 2 reputable trading protocol (or social trading as the title suggests), and the current bisq version. For example, the trader could obtain their first bitcoin on the reputation protocol to then eventually use it to trade on the current Bisq version.
This journey is what I have previously described as a conversion and should be favoured by the new trader as Bisq v1 provides a higher level of security than the reputable trading protocol.

As other protocols in Bisq 2 become available, various continuous journeys such as this can be encouraged (if applicable), and the design should aim to reflect this.

[pazza83]

@pazza83 splitting the role is a good idea, it encourages proficiency and an increasingly speedier service. But from what @jmacxx has pointed out in reference to the Support Agents as technicians, a tech focused and trade focused split could be more beneficial, what do you think?

I think it depends on how it would be structured.

When launched I think it would be best to keep to current structures.

Everything above seems to me to be within the scope of mediator as it occurs within the app.

As it develops new roles / ways of working can be decided on and specific roles created accordingly.

I agree with the @jmacxx that the role above would be best tilled Mediator Summary, and the Support Agent referred to as Mediator.

[chimp1984]

Here is an update of current state of the chat system for the social trading part.

Still missing some UI features like:

• Highlighting tags in the chat messages. Predefined tags are trade related keywords like BUY/SELL/EUR/USD/SEPA,... but user can edit them. Search filter can use those as well to have more fine grained search options.
• Emoticons support in text as well as reactions
• More options in message rollover submenu
• @ based mention popup in input field
• User profile should contain a user defined (local) tag (e.g. EUR to tag a user profile to some use case/context) and a badge for trusted sellers, channel admins, moderators, mediators

Edit own chat message:

Show user detail info on click on user icon:

Channel info (

Ignored users are shown then under members in channel settings and can be "un-ignored".

Notifications settings (per channel):

Search:

[chimp1984]

Ambassador sounds good to me! And true Liquidity provider is not that bad either. Ambassador might associate too much trust though, Bisq does not vet for them, burned BSQ does not mean they cannot be scammer (yet, being a real ambassador does not exclude to be a scammer either ;-)).

Is it necessary to click accepting the "terms of contract"?

I think thats very preliminary... we should only add the bare minimum required. And be aware that the more text we present the lower the chance users read it (at least in may case).

[UX-P]

Thanks for the feedback!

When we have multiple trade protocols, can the user create multiple profiles?

I think it depends on the protocol so the main needs for a new profile would need to be assessed. Do you know of any key reasons? For example, 2 different usernames will be necessary for a new trader who has completed a trade and would like to communicate on the social channels but would prefer to not have their community profile tied to their trading profile. In this case, the trader would only have the ability to create a new ID after completing a trade.

A limit on the ID creations should be encouraged, this promotes good user management and prevents errors from occurring.

Reputable trading: What about "Social trading"?

‘Social trading’ is good but already exists as a type of platform and is a strategy associated with copying the behavioural pattern of investor’s trades, so people may get the wrong idea. I think a name for this protocol would be good to brainstorm.

is it necessary to click accepting the "terms of contract"? I'm not used to see this in free software,

@MwithM Agreed. Terms and conditions sounds too corporate. Maybe calling it Trading Terms, Chat Rules, Trading Rules…just another way of letting the user know before they proceed, that they will be using this trading platform at their own risk

Something like ambassador or onboarding trader. Liquidity provider didn't seem so bad...

How about using different levels/stages: Novice, Advanced and Expert?
This has a positive association with the term ‘expert user’ regarding tech savvy users so could easily be adopted as a Bisq trading term. A tooltip should be available on the ‘Trader Type’ header field to explain each stage. I have shown this in the example below, nothing is official so this can be updated once a suitable name has been decided.

[UX-P]

What if the user does not want yet to trade? I guess we offer a skip button so the user can go "read only" mode as well.

That's a good consideration and so I have updated the user journey. I don't recommend the skip option, but instead reference the way Bisq 1 is currently used. The user would most likely prefer to browse first before creating an offer, the UI should directly lead the user to the Bisq social channels depending on the users tag selection (they are free to browse other channels of course).

In this scenario the new trader would like to browse available trades with the ability to create an offer if necessary.

Updated User Journey
Page 2- The username field can be a dropdown if there are other identities to select
Up to two tags can be added and is displayed on the user profile (view user profile options)

Page 3- The new trader can click on the Reputable trader’s offer to view their full profile, on the right and click the ‘take offer’ button.

‘Create Offer’ button on the left- the user can create their own offer if they cannot find one that matches their requirements.

The ‘Reputable Trading’ protocol drop down on the left provides the user with the freedom to switch between protocols whenever they like.
When the user switches protocols, there could be a pop up asking the user if they would like to keep their current username or switch to another (if any).

[chimp1984]

Do you know of any key reasons?

Have not thought too much about the other protocols yet. But I guess an onboarding screen would be useful there as well. E.g. Atomic cross chain swap will require full btc and monero nodes, so user need to be informed about requirements...

‘Social trading’ is good but already exists as a type of platform and is a strategy associated with copying the behavioural pattern of investor’s trades, so people may get the wrong idea. I think a name for this protocol would be good to brainstorm.

Yes I heard of that as well. Better to not squatter an existing term then. Also "social" is a bit silicon valley speak anyway....
What about "Satoshi square"? Now that Square has rebranded they cannot make us troubles anymore with tardemark issues ;-)

Novice, Advanced and Expert?

Hm... not sure if that covers correctly the (weak) security feature? But maybe we can combine that associalt property of being an expert with being trustworthy by using a term referring to BSQ/DAO?
Maybe something similar to "skin in the game"?

[Conza88]

Need (i) at as many points as possible to provide contextual info/helpful reference to wiki/guide if someone wants to know more.
I can 'be the noob'; because that part is fairly easy.

Hashwhat? Nah, you lost me.

[chimp1984]

For reputation we consider to use burned BSQ only as other reputation options do not work well with privacy protection/decentralization/veriability. See bisq-network/bisq2#152 for more context.

[Conza88]

A particular way to increase demand for BSQ? lol
#fairenough

[chimp1984]

I had today a discussion with @ripcurlx and he suggested to lauch the social trading part as independent application. Once we have more trade protocols we still can add the social trading part to the full Bisq 2 app and maybe let outfade the standalone app if no demand or otherwise keep both for different target groups.
I like the idea as it avoids the need to mentions/explain other trade protocols so for newbies its easier.
Also it allows to position that part more independently to existing Bisq (and not get confused as replacement/competition).
We could brand it to "Bisq - Satoshi square" and focus more on the Satoshi square aspects.

What do you think?

Another idea was to change the style to a more reduces/simplifies cypherpunk aestethic similar what @pedromvpg used for the no-KYC videos. The current Bisq style has a bit more corporate feeling due the usage of the material design.
We have still not found a good replacement for the JFoenix JavaFx library which implements material design. And for security reasons we are very conservative to add some new library. Using a more simplifies design we could stick with the standard JavaFX components and only apply css styling and maybe some animations in a limited extent.

[Conza88]

Satoshi square nails it.
Sats come to mind, small payments. Square/community. Gives off right vibe. Bisq branding lends credibility.

Risks of folks wanting to use it instead of Bisq desktop/main app? i.e. cheaper etc? Its also on the app, so they move there and think replacing it?

[chimp1984]

Satoshi square has some history:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1ep2up/satoshi_square_the_open_outcry_bitcoin_exchange/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAI3ij-rrsU

Risks of folks wanting to use it instead of Bisq desktop/main app? i.e. cheaper etc? Its also on the app, so they move there and think replacing it?

Sellers will have higher premiums. about 10-15% is usual at keybase.matrix channels.

[Conza88]

• It is only for BTC to fiat.

Perfect. Anything else would be an insult to Satoshi.

• BTC sellers need to have reputation earned by burned BSQ.
• After the trade the buyer is requested to provide feedback which will be publicly visible to others. That way others can see the number of past trades of a seller and the feedback score.

Think trades are mutually beneficial. Both should be able to rate eachother? Like uber drivers can rate passengers... shit one; eventually don't get any lifts.

How to impute reputation and flag it publicly but not get someone thrown under the bus privacy wise... e.g. "1,000 trades" puts them on the hook for privacy is the state ends up being one of those. Showing the rating of trader only, not number... ? But a scammer trades with themselves? I guess BSQ burned really is the only answer?

• Also the seller can/should leave feedback but its less relevant for the system

Incentive to drive folks to Bisq desktop? Or intro them in? If someone has a good trade intro; they may want to continue with that relationship in Bisq? via a bigger purchase?

The incentive for sellers - is they get someone coming into Bitcoin... likely as new future hodler... or with a KYC stack to convert... and seller could strike up a relationship that benefits them, driving down % rates per haps... on the hope that old mate new buyer wants a LOT MORE to come in the future....?

• Liquidity indications? e.g. volume transacted in X market over Y period.

In terms of offers - way for multi-offer options? e.g. seller can receive multiple currencies, and buyer can buy in multiple...?

Essence, is wanting to avoid no market offers/sellers in smaller currencies/regions/local bootstrapping being killed entirely... and we see the exact same shitty scenario were funds gravitate towards EUR for example (despite everyone not being in there).

The question is there enough 'staying power' in a local currency channel? Frequency may be far less in e.g. a Vietnamese market, but if I recently joined and can see an offer from a month ago; and if I could reach out to that person still - 'OH HEY, I see your old offer, still able to do that?"

Then I think it would go a way to solving that local community / currency issue to an extent.

[chimp1984]

Update of current state:

[ripcurlx]

I do like the new sub-text and the rotating infos during startup 👍
The Make your choice is a little bit too text loaded and needs some @pedromvpg love IMO.
Are the markets and payment methods pre-defined or can people create their own markets and payment methods as well?

[ripcurlx]

I think the currently selected market in public channels needs a better visual indication IMO. Maybe give it a colored box background or something similar to make it more recognizable.

[chimp1984]

Yes the Make your choice screen needs more text (i asled @m52go for help) and design (@pedromvpg should become available after the conference) love ;-).... but i think at least conceptually/content wise its more or less ok...

markets and payment methods pre-defined

Markets are a drop box fo all BTC markets. I think we only support the BTC path not altcoin-fiat or fiat-fiat or any/any... thats possible in text chat but not from our provided UI to keep the onboarding btc newies as focus.

Payment methods are atm a hard coded list per channel which is also used for the tags. The tags can be edited by the user and that would then be reflected in the dropdown. The channel admin provides the initial list but users can adjust to their needs, but highlighting would only work for users who have also added that tag.

public channels needs a better visual indication

Yes the selection UI needs more work. Had been focussed on the onboarding screens atm. Waiting for some open tasks for the chat UI to be completed from other devs, so did not want to touch too much there to not interfere. Also highlighting is missing, but thats on my todo list for today...

[UX-P]

Here is an update of the user journey to match the changes. User Journey Update

The text has been shortened (the text is not official, it is just an example) to keep it concise and not overwhelming to the users. The 'Undecided' category has been removed and 'New to Bisq Satoshi Square...' added to widen the target audience for this category, I have also drafted a quick redesigned of the 'make your choice' screen just to keep it consistent with the previous screen.
A hover button has been added instead of a 'call to action' button for 'Try another username' what do you think? I'm not entirely certain with that decision, but the problem is the two buttons on top of each other will not be consistent with the button layout throughout the app.

Conceptually I think we're doing well so far and the UI should start to take form once @pedromvpg joins, feedback welcome!

[UX-P]

Here is a summary on bitcoin meet-ups and Satoshi Square using this affinity map, the links below demonstrate how each point could be applied to the Bisq Satoshi Square user experience.

Mission statement

The aim is to bring like-minded people together, educate new users, trade with peers, and help to build a trusting bitcoin community through a decentralised P2P social platform.

Add relevant tabs/options

Sidebar tabs should be readily available to the user, as these are subject areas that are discussed and taught during Bitcoin meet-ups and Satoshi Square meet-ups in the past.

The sidebar collapses when the user enters the Satoshi Square community tab. with only the icons in view. When the user hovers over the icons a tool tip identifies each icon with text.

Learn tab

This is an opportunity to educate new traders about Bisq and decentralisation while answering those recurring questions, now it can be found in one place. It would also be helpful to include short video tutorials or step by step instructions eventually.

Events tab

As well as the regular trades between peers, there could also be planned events e.g. 14th May BITCOIN MAYHEM at 7.00pm EST. Where all reputable sellers can be online at the same time, channel moderator and admin all helping, exchange ideas, trading, educating, discussing (depending on the event).

Tip: Create an event channel and change the titles accordingly, all users should be able to add a tag as a sign that they are a participant.
An incentive would make trading events a little more appealing.

Events could also feature special talks and discussions on a particular Bisq subject where reputable users, contributors, channel moderators can host, answer questions and help to educate.

Set it as a regular occurrence e.g. once a month

Wallet tab

Educate users on:

• The risks of losing your wallet

• Creating backups

• Maintaining a separate wallet

• Recovery and lack of recovery

• Recommended wallet

This information would probably be in the 'Learn' tab' so I'm not sure if this tab is necessary but I have left it there in case aa wallet feature is in the works.

Security tab

• Include documentation on security and safety, advising users on how to ensure maximum safety while trading.

• Provide security options (I don’t know what these would be).

• Bisq Satoshi rules can be found here e.g. trading rules, chat rules etc

• Basic Computer Security – Do not download or run applications from untrusted sources

It’s a clickable prototype so feel free to go through all the sidebar options

[chimp1984]

Ah wow, thats great input and thanks a lot for the new wireframe, that helps a lot!

Things are getting really more to the meat of the idea now!

[chimp1984]

Here is an update of current screens. Improved the onboarding screens and the chat UI.

User profile setup:

Newbie:

Expert user:

Create offer:

Chat:

Peer info:

[chimp1984]

Did a bigger re-styling and made the left menu collapsible.
Added placeholder screens for the eduaction and event content.

[chimp1984]

FYI: similar ideas for P2P trading in chat groups:
https://gitlab.com/sovereign-individuals/p2p-exchange-protocol
https:/taxmeifyoucan/p2p-trading/

[chimp1984]

Getting more of Pedros design implemented. Animations are added as well...

[ripcurlx]

The only UI element that feels a little bit out of place is the icon to hide/show the side panel IMO.

[chimp1984]

Yes, it was too bright, I changed to to darker and also it fades in only at rollover the left menu area and fades out when left, so its not visible normally.

[chimp1984]

Got now a good part adjusted to @pedromvpg 's design.

Onboarding screens:

Set up user profile:

Set up trading profile:

Create market offer:

Combobox select:

Chat screens (in case there are multiple users with the same nickname - as Bruno in that case - we show additionally the profile ID):

Markets chat:

Private trade chat:

Discussions:

User info:

Channel info:

Learn/education screen (some icons like on the webpage would be nice to the different topics):

Other screens (not updated to design, very rough prototypes)
Create offer:

Offerbook :

Portfolio:

Settings:

[UX-P]

Great! A few UX considerations:

Set up user profile
The user profile nickname box requires repositioning, it must be positioned beneath the user image like so:

For consistency the ‘choose trader’ page should also be of the same format as the previous page and showing the avatar and as discussed, the ‘create offer’ would not be the ideal 3rd step. The user joins Satoshi square in this step:

Markets chat

The ‘create offer’ button should be positioned away from the text box, the user can mistake this for a confirmation button. As shown on the original design:

Create offer
When the user creates an offer, they should already have an avatar at this point of the journey. The avatar should therefore be displayed in the top right corner.

And I do suggest framing the image and text for a more user friendly design, this helps to divide the content into relevant sections and group information while directing the users focus to the most relevant sections of the page. The education screen demonstrates a good example of this.

and will the 'trade' tab on the main menu be for the reputable trader? Just wondering if there is a necessity for another trade offer screen. Or does this refer to a different protocol?

[chimp1984]

Thanks for the inputs! Will adjust them.

and will the 'trade' tab on the main menu be for the reputable trader? Just wondering if there is a necessity for another trade offer screen. Or does this refer to a different protocol?

Thats one of the questions I am working on right now. For the first release where we intend to ship only the Chat based trading it would not matter so much but I think its valueable for communication whats on the roadmap and give an overview about the planned protocols (specially for existing Bisq users who might feel confused if they see the low-security chat based protocol only - a problem I underestimated from feedback I saw so far...).

I am a bit unsure if we should leave the trade chat part inside the Satoshi Square area or put it into the main trade protocols. Somehow I tend to the latter atm but we could even have it placed in both locations if that would help the newbie onboarding process. The big trade protocol overview should not be a main screen for newbies as its too advanced.

I just started to work on the trade screen and intend to add an overview screen to see all protocols and see the differences (much more work needed here to demonstrate the strengts and requirements of each protocol) and then have tabs for each protocol.
The overview screen needs much more work... just started on it... but might give an idea what it should lead to. (Satoshi square on the left menu and in the tabs would not work... will need to find a fix for that... Maybe "Social" on the left menu is better?)

Another option would be to add on the left menu a secondary level menu below the trade item with the different trade protocols.

[chimp1984]

Worked on an alternative protocol overview screen.
I think the first approach with the widget-like fields does not work that well as we would repeat information and it would not provide a quick overview about the pro/con of each protocol.

There are tooltips for each stars so user can get more background info.

This still would need some design improvements from @pedromvpg . Maybe some coloring of the stars of different icons for the categories instead of the stars?

@UX-P What do you think?

[UX-P]

I think the above table is useful for the user to make an overall decision on which protocol suits them best however, they would also be interested in learning more. As overview screens or dashboards regularly use card elements, I suggest a design that incorporates both.

Here are a few examples of overview tabs using card elements

Here is an example of the overview table at the top and the cards underneath:

At the moment the cards are a little too informative, it should contain 2 or 3 lines of a quick, snappy description of the protocol to entice the user in wanting to learn more

[chimp1984]

Added a sub-menu for the protocols to left navigation instead of using tabs.
We can add a global offerbook then to trade (for all offers of all protocols).

@pedromvpg I guess small icons instead of using the first letter as I did now would be better. What do you think?

[chimp1984]

We could move then the 3 portfolio tabs inside the protocol pages next to offerbook. Create and take offer screens would be popups.

So all those sub sections for a protocol would be inside the protocol for the specific data and would have a global version as well under trade where its collected from all protocols. Will then probably have less specific information to not overload the tables.
Idea is to have a global overview about all and to get inside the protocol screen the detail info.

[chimp1984]

Applied the change of the portfolio sub pages.

So there are global offerbook/open offers/open trades/history with high level info and all protocols collected and then there are tabs with those sub screens inside the protoocl pages with the more specific data. Not 100% sure if it will work well for pending trades...

[chimp1984]

@UX-P @pedromvpg
According to your call today I removed the duplicated exchange chat screen and added a primary landing page instead where the user gets 2 buttons to the satoshi square chat or to the protocol overview page.

We can guide the user from the onboarding screens directly to those targe pages as well. The primary landing page should more serve for those who skip the onboarding.

Content is just placeholder and would require some nice design from Pedro. But should follow the idea of the last screen.

[chimp1984]

Long time no updates... Here the latest state:
bisq-network/bisq2#470